Space & Astronomy/Space and Astronomy (October 1993).iso/mac/TEXT/SPACEDIG/V13_3/V13_322.TXT

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Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #322

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 13 : Issue 322

Today's Topics:
               I want to go to orbit...
    MAJOR GEOMAGNETIC STORM UPDATE #1 - 26 MARCH - STORM CONTINUES
            Re: Japan Moon Probes article
            Re: Japan Moon Probes article
                Re: "Follies"

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    Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to
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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 25 Mar 91 17:46:21 GMT
From: usc!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu!quiche![e-mail]  (Mark SOKOLOWSKI)
Subject: I want to go to orbit...


    Hi,

    What are the steps in order to build a reliable space-shuttle like
spaceship in order to send myself to orbit for the summer holidays?
I'm thinking about a 20-30 ton rocket with a 900 kg payload made up of
a car sized hypersonic glidder, fitted with 3 rocket engines. There will
be 2 boosters of about 10 tons each, and a main liquid hydrogen-oxygen
tank of about 10 tons too. I have a Chalet near a lake with some forest
behind (covered with lots of other chalets and people... sighhh, but I
can manage to get a 50ft X 50ft field on which to start my project) where
I plan to launch this private space shuttle from an underground tunnel
(Ha ha... what a surprise for my neighboors: Is it an earthquake? No, ME!).
I guess I'll break the canadian law forbidding to send rocket of more
than 650 gramms (20 oz) in the air... but I'll land somewhere else.
Thanks in advance for any advice.

Mark

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 91 23:20:44 MST
From: [e-mail] (CARY OLER)
Subject: MAJOR GEOMAGNETIC STORM UPDATE #1 - 26 MARCH - STORM CONTINUES
X-St-Vmsmail-To: st%"[e-mail]"

                       /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

                            GEOMAGNETIC STORM UPDATE

                       /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

                               06:00 UT, 26 March

                                 -------------


STORM UPDATE INFORMATION:

     The geomagnetic field is still very stormy.  Minor to major magnetic
perturbations have been measured over all latitudes.  Severe storming has
occurred over the high latitudes.  The activity tonight isn't quite as
intense as it was yesterday, although some large magnetic excursions have
occurred.

     Auroral activity is intense again tonight over North America, although
it doesn't appear to be quite as intense as it was 24 hours ago.  No
low-latitude auroral activity reports have been received yet, although low
latitude sightings may still be possible.

     No significant proton enhancements have been observed from the major
class X5.3/3B flare earlier this UT day.  This leads us to believe that the
terrestrial impacts most likely will not be as intense as the present
storm.  However, a risk still exists for major geomagnetic storming over
middle latitudes if an interplanetary shock hits the Earth.  We do believe
a shock will arrive, sometime between approximately 09:00 UT and the end of
the present UT day.  The intensity of the ensuing geomagnetic activity is
predicted to remain at minor to major storm levels until approximately 28
March, when conditions should begin to improve (again, barring any further
energetic flaring).

     HF propagation conditions will remain poor to very poor for most (if
not all) of 26 March.  If an interplanetary shock arrives as expected,
conditions could become degraded again with frequent blackout periods
from polar latitudes to middle latitudes.  Polar and high latitudes are still
experiencing intense magnetic and PCA related ionospheric absorption.
Conditions are not expected to improve there for at least the next 24 to 48
hours.  We aren't out of the woods yet.

     VHF and UHF auroral backscatter communications will remain possible,
particularly over the middle and high latitudes.  If storming surpasses
predicted levels, low-latitude auroral communications may become possible.
Conditions are still favorable for auroral backscatter communications
and will likely remain fairly favorable for the next 24 to 48 hours,
particularly if the flare shock arrives as expected.

     The next update will be released around 18:00 UT on 26 March.  All
alerts and warnings remain in effect.  No changes have been made since the
last magnetic storm update report.


The following alerts remain IN PROGRESS until at least 18:00 UT, 26 March:

   - MAJOR GEOMAGNETIC STORM ALERT
   - GEOMAGNETICALLY INDUCED CURRENT (GIC) ALERT
   - LOW LATITUDE AURORAL ACTIVITY ALERT
   - SATELLITE PROTON EVENT ALERT
   - POLAR CAP ABSORPTION EVENT ALERT
   - POLAR AND HIGH LATITUDE RADIO SIGNAL BLACKOUT ALERT


The following warnings are IN PROGRESS:

   - POTENTIAL GEOMAGNETIC STORM WARNING (valid 26/27 March)
   - POTENTIAL MAJOR SOLAR FLARE WARNING
   - POTENTIAL PROTON FLARE WARNING


                       /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

------------------------------

Date: 25 Mar 91 00:12:11 GMT
From: magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!ccut!wnoc-tyo-news!astemgw!kuis!rins![e-mail]  (will)
Subject: Re: Japan Moon Probes article


Article <[e-mail]> Sat 00:04
Subject: Re: Japan Moon Probes article
From: [e-mail] (Edwin L Turner @ Princeton University)
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.astro
(14 lines)

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (
Ron Baalke) writes:
>>The Times says the $100 million mission would make the
>>Japanese the third group to land a probe on the moon, after the
>>U.S. and the Soviet Union.  The story says the probes will be
>>ready in Spring, 1996.
>
In article <[e-mail]>[e-mail] (Edwin L Turner @ Princeton University) writes:
>And you can safely bet that they will be, too.
>

    Absolutly, I agree.  After all, any country that can destroy America
    can go to any moon of their choice.  In case you hav'nt herd, America
    surrendered to Japan in Kuwait.  That was the main purpose of Foreign
    Minister Taro Nakayama to Washington, to remind the President that the
    U.S. in now owned by Japan and that Washington D.C. has been moved to
    Tokyo Japan.

                                        William Dee Rieken
                                        Researcher, Computer Visualization
                                        Faculty of Science and Technology
                                        Ryukoku University
                                        Seta, Otsu 520-21,
                                        Japan

                                        Tel: [phone](direct)
                                        Fax: [phone]
                                        [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 25 Mar 91 03:30:22 GMT
From: magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!ccut!wnoc-tyo-news!astemgw!kuis!rins![e-mail]  (will)
Subject: Re: Japan Moon Probes article


In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (
Ron Baalke) writes:
>>>The Times says the $100 million mission would make the
>>>Japanese the third group to land a probe on the moon, after the
>>>U.S. and the Soviet Union.  The story says the probes will be
>>>ready in Spring, 1996.
>>
In article <[e-mail]>[e-mail] (Edwin L Tu
rner @ Princeton University) writes:
>>And you can safely bet that they will be, too.
>>
In article <[e-mail]>[e-mail] (will) writes:
>Absolutly, I agree.  After all, any country that can destroy America
>can go to any moon of their choice.  In case you hav'nt herd, America
>surrendered to Japan in Kuwait.  That was the main purpose of Foreign
>Minister Taro Nakayama to Washington, to remind the President that the
>U.S. in now owned by Japan and that Washington D.C. has been moved to
>Tokyo Japan.


    Well, my statements were overkill and unwarrented, based without
actual facts, and most likely an insult to the intellectuals on sci.space.  It
is'nt my intentions to comment on Japan in the sense that I am another
McCarthy on a witch hunt for the Japanese.  My intentions are to bring about
issues, In reference to a particular group, that are not normally addressed
about the relations of Japan and the U.S. and the effects of Japanese policys
on the U.S..  I am not anti-japanese or anti-anything else, and I despise
prejudice people.  I try to make useful and constructive remarks, but in this
case I screwed up, big time.  I therefore would like to apologise for my
earlier remarks.  I have placed the reflections below, so that you get an
idea of what I tried to say.  I any case, they are my comments and I may be
wrong, but just maybe I may also be right.  If anyone is interested in
constructive talks about Japan and U.S. relations, please write me.

Reflections:
    1. After all, any country that can destroy America can go to any
    moon of their choice.:
        This is not really valid, America sold itself out to the
        Japanese and is now paying the price.

    2. In case you hav'nt heard, America surrendered to Japan in Kuwait.
        The issue here is not 'surrender' but can American companies
        compete against Japan in the Kuwait Theatre.  If not, then
        I will show once and for all, that Japan is the Victor on the
        Economic Wars front.

    3. The Visit of the foreign minister.
        Living in Japan now for over 8 years.  Watching very closely
        the relations between Japan and the U.S., I found this to
        be a valid assesment of his intended visit.  An American
        reporter once said: (This is approx.) " The ruler's of America
        got tired of ruling, so sold everything to the Japanese".
        On this side of the ocean, it looks like he was right.


    In any respect, if the Japanese place a probe on the moon, great.  If
    they can place a moon base there fine.  I think the U.S. has had plenty
    of time to place a base on the moon and place a space-station in orbit.
    If we can'nt do, then the U.S. must stand aside and let someone who can
    do, do it.  What's really hard to believe is that the country that put
    man on another planet, can't even put a space station in orbit that's
    useful for long term.  Too much politics and very little work it seems.


                                        William Dee Rieken
                                        Researcher, Computer Visualization
                                        Faculty of Science and Technology
                                        Ryukoku University
                                        Seta, Otsu 520-21,
                                        Japan

                                        Tel: [phone](direct)
                                        Fax: [phone]
                                        [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 91 21:35:23 EST
From: John Roberts <[e-mail]>
Disclaimer: Opinions expressed are those of the sender
    and do not reflect NIST policy or agreement.
Subject: Re: "Follies"


>From: [e-mail] (Perry G Ramsey)
>Subject: Re: "Follies"
>Date: 22 Mar 91 16:37:17 GMT
>Organization: Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences

>You guys tell all these sad tales to the Indians who lived in the
>Salt Lake area or Massachusetts for many years before the Europeans
>dropped in and showed them how to exist.

It was the opposite situation at least for the Plymouth colony, as you
surely know. At least according to the high school history textbooks, the
Plymouth colonists probably would have died off entirely if the Indians
hadn't shown them how to get along in their new environment.
Plymouth Colony is a very good example of how *not* to set up a new colony.

>There's fresh water.  There (was) abundant wild game.  There are
>a variety of edible plants, if you know which are which.

There's water (not highly concentrated, but a large amount overall), soil,
minerals, and energy (sunlight) available on the moon, and probably on a
number of asteroids.

>Even the deepest desert of southern California supported human
>existence before the Europeans dammed the creeks and  destroyed the
>wildlife.

There *were*, I believe, uninhabited areas in North America (and still are).

>Even the most hostile desert on earth is infinitely
>more hospitable than the moon.

"Infinitely" is not a very useful term. If you don't want to use numbers,
I can say that humans are "infinitely" more able to survive in a hostile
environment than they were at the time of the settlement of Salt Lake City.
Which "infinity" is greater?

>That doesn't say that lunar colonization is impossible.  It does say
>that you aren't going to do it on the cheap, as the original post
>claimed.  An very well developed transportation infrastructure is essential
>if you are going to keep the colonists supplied with the basic
>necessities of life.

"Cheap" is a relative term. What I said was that I think it could probably
be done with *less* than four orders magnitude drop in transportation costs.
In the past, Henry Spencer has mentioned a proposal someone made to start a
minimal moon colony with one or a small number of Shuttle launches. (I don't
remember the details - perhaps this would be a good time to describe it
again.) While I'm not convinced it's a good idea to try to start up an
absolute minimum colony (the risks are very high), I think it's very useful
to figure out what the minimum would be, because this can give us information
on the size of effort and the level of technology needed to set up a colony
that has a fairly good chance of success.

>You can't eat moon rocks, no matter how many
>important minerals they might contain.

Since we earth people basically eat earth rocks, why couldn't we eat moon
rocks? Of course, there's some amount of processing needed. Surely you're
not going to suggest that the American Indians all just slept naked on the
ground and fed themselves exclusively by picking objects up off the ground
and putting them in their mouths. For almost any environment, there's a need
for processing of materials, construction of shelter, production of food
(by means of solar energy), etc.

>Perry G. Ramsey           Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences
>[e-mail]    Purdue University, W. Lafayette, IN USA
>[e-mail]   ***  IMAGINE YOUR LOGO HERE  ******
        John Roberts
        [e-mail]

------------------------------

End of SPACE Digest V13 #322
*******************